tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2410716623228444076.post8856534573177389054..comments2024-03-28T13:10:04.655+00:00Comments on The Notion Club Papers - an Inklings blog: The greatest mystery of C.S Lewis's life - is it so mysterious?Bruce Charltonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09615189090601688535noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2410716623228444076.post-7524880369026738722014-07-09T12:58:35.370+01:002014-07-09T12:58:35.370+01:00@MA - I'm sorry you find this poorly researche...@MA - I'm sorry you find this poorly researched! - I presume you are a professional Lewis scholar who has been reading solidly for the past decade - because otherwise you couldn't possibly have read more of Lewis's work, and about Lewis and his circle than I have!<br /><br />I think you really mean just that you *disagree* with this speculation. <br /><br />I would regard points 1. and 2. as irrelevant to Lewis's secrecy and dishonesty about his relationship with Mrs Moore.<br /><br />How childhood experience affects adult behaviours is a highly speculative field, fool of falsehoods (e.g. by Freud and influenced by Freud) - most empirical studies show zero measurable relationship between childhood experience and adult personality (see Judith Rich Harris's The Nurture Assumption). <br /><br />Lewis himself is no more a reliable witness in this respect than anyone else. <br /><br />wrt point 3 - Warnie's alcholoic binges were not a problem until the early 1940s - so far as I can tell from the available information - but I have NOT read Warnie's un-published diaries at Wheaton College. The problem is to explain why binge drinking began in a man in his fifties. <br /><br />Of course, once the pattern of binge drinking has been established, this may have a permanent effect - it is clear that Warnie in middle age and later life became 'an alcoholic' in the sense of Alcoholics Anonymous. But he was not that way in the first 2/3 of his life. <br /><br />"I do think it's a possibility that Lewis had sexual relations with Mrs. Moore" - I think the sexual relationship is now established, from the eyewitness circumstantial report of Maureen Moore (Mrs Moore's daughter) as reported by George Sayer in the revised edition of 'Jack' - his biography of CSL.Bruce Charltonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09615189090601688535noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2410716623228444076.post-7235282067062611402014-07-09T09:15:25.287+01:002014-07-09T09:15:25.287+01:00This is unfortunately a very one sided and poorly ...This is unfortunately a very one sided and poorly researched article. Note that I do not mind speculating if Lewis might have had deeper, more intimate affections for Mrs. Moore, but the writer of the article fails to address important details that make the situation much more difficult to comprehend OR assume one side or the other.<br /><br />1. Lewis' mother, Flora Lewis, died in her bed at home on 23 August 1908. Lewis wrote in "Surprised by Joy" that the moment had chronically scarred him. "WIth my mother's death all settled happiness, all that was tranquil and reliable disappeared from my life" (23). Mrs. Moore may have provided Lewis with a mere maternal affection that he greatly missed. <br /><br />2. The absence of his father, Albert Lewis, also provoked Jack, as his friends called him, into searching for "family." Albert first sent Warnie off to school in England, which separated Jack from his brother and best companion. Lewis was later sent to schools in England, and detested them at first, referring to one of them by the name of a concentration camp "Belsen" when later writing about it. In his correspondence, Lewis often lied to his father, though he regretted these actions after becoming a Christian. After his father died, Lewis remained with Mrs. Moore and her daughter Maureen. They were "family" to him. Mrs. Moore had lost her son in the Great War, and in that respect, Lewis became the son and Mrs. Moore the mother. <br /><br />3. The article mentioned the "tragedy" of Lewis causing Warnie's alcoholism. It's hard to find truth in such a statement, considering Warnie's past. Warnie not only fought in the trenches of WWI, he also served as an officer in WWII as well. Whereas Lewis found a way to compartmentalize the traumatic experiences in the Great War, Warnie found more solace in his alcoholic binges. As recorded by Alister McGrath in the biography, "C.S. Lewis: A Life", Warnie even missed part of Jack's funeral ceremony because he was drunk. Warnie may have had much more difficulty coping with the images of war, they seem to have had a permanent affect on him. It is also hard to believe that Lewis was the cause of Warnie's alcoholism, because Warnie had problems with alcohol before He knew Lewis had become acquaintances with Mrs. Moore. It seems more probably that Warnie's alcoholism was most likely due to his wartime experiences, and less because of Lewis' influence. One last further note is that Warnie's binges did not cease after the death of Mrs. Moore on 12 January 1951. <br /><br />I do think it's a possibility that Lewis had sexual relations with Mrs. Moore, however this article assumed far too much about Lewis' life, while ignoring crucial details. Personally, I vouch that Lewis' did not have these relations with Mrs. Moore, that it was a maternal affection serving to replace much of what he'd lost with his biological mother. However, I cannot disprove that there may have been greater affections. <br /><br />The case, then, still remains a great mystery. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01662232122791621275noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2410716623228444076.post-61553027069181813432012-08-07T04:28:33.807+01:002012-08-07T04:28:33.807+01:00@Ariston - thanks for the comment. I didn't kn...@Ariston - thanks for the comment. I didn't know that.Bruce Charltonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09615189090601688535noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2410716623228444076.post-26638289670595637012012-08-06T23:34:23.177+01:002012-08-06T23:34:23.177+01:00Interestingly, Orthodox Christians do not swear vo...Interestingly, Orthodox Christians do not swear vows; there are affirmations at baptisms and—especially adult baptisms—but they are of belief and membership in the community, not of particular behaviors. A lot of people are surprised that Orthodox do not even swear wedding vows (or monastic ones, for that matter). The only words my wife and I spoke when married were that we were there of our own free will.<br /><br />Now, I'm not saying this as evidence of Orthodox moral superiority— I think Latin Christianity was correct to embrace the vow–centric nature of Roman law and culture for certain profound acts, like marriage (or, much later, monastic vows). They mirrored the law and culture of those peoples (though they may have less well–fit the later Germanic Christians). I think both traditions were vow–cautious in the religious realm; Christ's words on the matter were not forgotten.<br /><br />However, those words are paired with the admonition that any verbal commitment is as strong as a vow; the condemnation is then about vows as hubris. The damage is there, no matter what, the vow may lead us into perverting the very meaning of the good that may have been sworn, which is an Aristotelian tragedy writ in a life.Aristonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05941177388074392732noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2410716623228444076.post-58596472078512358402012-08-06T17:58:57.813+01:002012-08-06T17:58:57.813+01:00@Dale - "vows should be rare indeed"
Ye...@Dale - "vows should be rare indeed"<br /><br />Yes, very true. Breaking a vow inevitably inflicts damage, keeping a vow may inflict even more damage - so a vow can lead to a 'double bind'. <br /><br />I think this is something to do with vows being (usually) too narrow and too specific.Bruce Charltonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09615189090601688535noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2410716623228444076.post-68972150671593869252012-08-05T15:32:54.176+01:002012-08-05T15:32:54.176+01:00This is worthwhile, responsible speculation.
It p...This is worthwhile, responsible speculation.<br /><br />It prompts this reflection -- that vows should be rare indeed. Offhand I would say that most Christians should perhaps make only two vows in their lives: at Confirmation, and when they marry. <br /><br />Usually what we see is that even these vows are not made in complete sincerity. A great deal of the misery that we see in society could be attributed to people not keeping these two vows.<br /><br />But, on the other hand, one generally should not make vows.<br /><br />(About Confirmation vows: I don't know about others' circles, but in mine, the Sunday service on which confirmands make their vows is the low point of the Church Year. Young people, having completed their years of catechesis, make vows which they break as of the next Sunday, when they fail to come to church. Thus their official entrance upon adult life as Christians is marked by insincerity. I think it would be well if there were public recognition of their having completed their Christian instruction, but a delay in their Confirmation. If in the interval they have been faithful in church attendance and other public marks of a Christian, then they could make their vows some time later.)Wurmbrandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17345523517796356674noreply@blogger.com